Forum Activity for @rosanne

I feel much more informed now, at least I can experiment and see how long the ganache stays good. I'll post my results after experimenting, can't thank you enough Andrea.

Sweeteners like glucose do several things for ganaches. They increase shelf life, improve texture and stabilize it (i.e prevent separation). They increase shelf life of a ganache by binding with water which lowers water activity levels and making it more resistant to spoilage.

How does adding glucose to the ganache extend the shelf-life?

I don't know much about freeze dried fruits. I've never used them after they have been rehydrated. I have used them in their freeze dried form and they are very flavor intensive. Raspberry might be too tart this way though and as I said I don't know about rehydrating them.

I have made raspberry ganache previouslyand my only comment is that you will lose some of the intensity of the fruit flavor. So if a subtle raspberry flavor is what you want a ganache is a great way to go.You'd probably be just fine making a raspberry-flavored ganache for the cake and not have to worry about the mold issue. You will get a more intense raspberry flavor if you reduce the puree before adding it. You could also extend the shelf life if you use glucose (corn syrup) in the ganache. Also, I'd use the puree in the ganache (as opposed to a jelly) because it will be a "fresher" flavor. Good luck with your cake and ganache! Andrea

Thanks Andrea for your reply and confirming what I was thinking. Making jelly sounds good but I was hoping to do something a little different with the ganache, can the jelly not be added to the ganache without worrying about molding? I keep reading about fruit flavoured ganache in cake fillings, so I guess these must be used on day of bake and consumed quickly. Would the same apply if I was to use freeze dried raspberries. hydrated and pureed? I've come across comments about dried fruits being used in chocolate making and was wondering whether the dry freeze might be a possibility. I've also been told adding glucose/glycerine can extend shelf life. I don't know whether that is correct plus I wouldn't know how it would affect the consistency of the ganache. Do you have any thoughts on this? Finally do people use butter ganache as cake filling? So many questions!! Perhaps I should just make some up and see how it holds up. I really appreciate your advice, thank you.

rosanne

I would worry about mold with a fresh raspberry puree esp. since it will be sitting for several days. Fresh fruit purees are not boiled when they are made. You puree up the fruit, run it thru a sieve to remove seeds and then add about 10% sugar by remaining weight. That said, various recipes do call for reducing the puree in half before using it in a ganache (it intensifies the flavor and reduces water content). Other recipes don't call for the puree to be reduced at all. I have a suggestion that might avoid the issue for you. Consider making just a plain chocolate ganache. Then use your puree to make a "jelly" to put on as another layer on the cake (puree, sugar and pectin and then undercook it to avoid it being too thick). The flavor will be nice and intense and I think you wouldn't have to worry about mold nearly as much.

Andrea

Hi Everyone

This is my very first post, I love being here and learning so much. My question is for raspberry ganache made from fresh fruit. The ganache will be for cake filling, working with dark chocolate 60% 2:1 choc to heavy cream. Do the raspberries have to be boiled up in sugars and reduced before adding? I'm wary of molding since the cake will be worked on for approx three days for celebration icing and decoration. It can not be refrigerated although it will be in a cool environment. I'd be interested to know what kind of shelf life to expect, and would appreciate any input. Thank you.

Well, I don't have any perforated sheet pans, but I would think just a trip to Bargreen's would net me some. I work with my mom's baking company out of the local food hub's commercial kitchen. We have a double Wolf stove with a 6 burners and a short grill, and a convection oven next to those. I've got plenty of options there, so I think the roaster is probably gonna be taken off the table for now...

Cooking anything evenly is about heat and airflow. You need both. A good example of what I'm talking about is putting two sheet pans in a regular oven - one on the top rack and one on the bottom. The product on the bottom rack will be burnt LONG before the product on the top rack is cooked, because the bottom rack blocks the air flow created by the heating element, thereby trapping the heat underneath it. This is slightly mitigated by staggering the trays (one on one side of the oven and and one on the other), instead of having them directly above of each other.

For your home oven, roast one tray at a time, and if possible use a perforated tray. Fill the tray so that the beans aren't stacked on top of each other, but at least you can't see much tray under your beans. If you have no perforated trays, you will need to stir the beans on the sheet pan every 5-10 minutes.

What I would suggest is to cut the bottom out of a sheet pan and fasten a metal screen in its place. This will let more airflow through and give you a much better roast regardless of whether or not you have a convection oven. Sheet pans are cheap, and so is screen.

In my shop we use perforated sheet pans. (you can buy them in North America at restaurant equipment supply places through special order). This along with a convection oven with the fan on low, works fabulously and we don't have to touch them once they go in the oven.

Hope that helps.

Brad

Yes, it does! I was worried about purchasing 220 pounds and then the beans going bad before I had the opportunity to roast and use them. Now I've got some definite hard thinking to do about what I'm going to purchase then...

And it definitely helps in determining how to roast em, but it opens up more questions too... How much do you roast at a time? Do you use a regular oven, or convection? Do you stir the beans in the pan at all?

Thanks Brad!

Keep the beans dry and they will store almost indefinitely.

With regard to the quality and the roast.... My grandmother always used to say thatyou "can't make a silk purse from a sow's ear."

She was right.

Roasting is an exercise of experience.Go with your nose to start. The beans will start smelling like brownies, then get quite acidic, and then go back to richdeepbrownies. It's at the third stage you are done. Do a low temperature roast to start (300f), and play around with times between 30 min and 60 min depending on the acidity of the bean. Smell them every 5 minutes to gain experience in what to expect.

Hope that helps.

Well, I guess I should have mentioned my budget, huh? lol. My total I have for this project is $2,260. I've been doing molded chocolates and truffles, and our chuch's retired pastor is completely in love with them. lol. I had mentioned my desire to make chocolate from scratch to him, and a week later I was in his living room outlining my budget to him as he cut me a check for what I needed. Deal is him and his wife get a pound of chocolates a month for the rest of their lives! It won't be an insanely long time as he's 86 and she's 92! lol.

Anyways, I figured that between what I have listed, and $200 for 20 lbs of beans (I estimated that, since the average price I"m finding is between $8.50 and $9.50 an lb), $365 for 55 lbs of cocoa butter, $120 for 50 lbs of milk powder and $125 for 50 lbs of Sucanat (all natural, organic, f/t, unprocessed), That brings the total up to $2230.

Now, I've got a better source than I had originally quoted him for my beans. Got a guy in Costa Rico that charges $4 a kilo, plus shipping. Once I get things going (and I know how to NOT ruin my chocolate), I'll make a 100 kilo order which comes out to be about $900 including shipping.

So, I guess I'm asking if I should just skip getting the champion and the roaster and get the 100kg order of beans to start with? If I don't get those two and add the $200 for beans to that, I've got $750, so I'd need another bill fifty from somewhere to get the entire order...

Also, how long can I keep the un-roasted beans for? Do they spoil after a certain amount of time? The commercial kitchen we're putting in the church (that's where we're gonna do our baking and my chocolates, since we're outgrowing the co-op we currently work with) won't be done for AT LEAST two months, and even then it's gonna take a while for me to figure out the proper techniques for roasting and whatnot. I want to order things soon, but I don't want almost a grand worth of beans to go rancid before I even get the chance to make them into chocolates.

Another thought I have is that I have been assuming that the roast really determines the flavor of the chocolate about as much as the individual beans themselves do (somewhat like coffee. If it's shit beans, the taste is shit no matter how well it's roasted, and if it's roasted improperly, it's shit no matter how high the bean quality is). Is that correct, or am I way off base there? And where can I find more information on how to roast properly? I haven't been able to find much of anything for that answer...

That's a good point actually re the Champion - even though I have one, I don't pre-grind the nibs in it before adding to the melanger . . . I just put my winnowed nibs straight into the melanger.

To back up Gap, you don't need a roaster. Cooking anything is about heat and airflow - plain and simple. Cocoa beans will roast just fine in your oven. I did it for 3 years before I started Choklat. Now I roast in a commercial convection oven and my beans cook perfectly.

You also don't need the juicer. It makes more of a mess than anything else. I only used the juicer the first month I made chocolate.

There. I've just saved you $540. Go buy more beans and have fun! After all, someone told me once (actually a couple of times). "It's just chocolate."

Cheers.

Brad

Depends how much you want to make and your budget.

I have a Melanger (I use a Premier Wet Grinder) and a Champion Juicer. I use the Champion for cracking beans because we happened to have one before I started making chocolate (I don't use a Crackenstein) and I use a hairdryer to winnow (I don't use a Slyph). I roast in an oven (so I don't use a Behomer).

I make 1-2kg batches at a time and find my setup works quickly and efficiently for me.

So, I've got a decent amount set aside to order the equipment I need for small scale bean-to-bar production, but I wanted to get some advice before ordering well over a thousand bucks worth of stuff.

So far, here's the list of what I'm ordering (it all just happens to be from the same place since I like to order locally, and Chocolate Alchemy is a small business only a state away):

Spectra 11 Melanger ($490)

Behemor 1600 Coffee and Cocoa Roaster (comes with 4 lbs of free cocoa beans!)($300)

Crankandstein Cocoa mill ($190)

Champion Juicer ($240)

Slyph Winnower($200)

Total = $1,420

Is there anything I'm missing from this list? I know I'm gonna need some sugar, and powdered milk, and cocoa butter. I'm also gonna be ordering a 55 pound block of CB from John too, since it's the best price I've seen on organic fair trade cocoa butter ($380 for 55 lbs of deoderized) since I started looking for supplies. I'm gonna wait on ordering it though (and the milk), since I'll be starting with only dark chocolate.

Any comments, questions? Please, help out a novice just starting out!

Thanks in advance!

~Tom

Some folks use a excalibur dehydrator. I've been eyeing reptile incubators lately!

I use my Mol d"Art melting tank. Ihave a 6kg tank and find it hold the gun and 4-5 colours. I leave them overnight before I plan to use them and leave them in the tank while I'm working as well.

Thanks Andrea I surely give it a trial.

Annibelle

You can try an inexpensive yogurt maker. They work at low heat. It can be trial and error but I've found that mine without the lid on it works well. I think mine was about $15. The brand of mine is Total Chef Yogurt Maker.

Thank you so much! This is exactly the kind of advice I was seeking! I should have been stirring more while I was dipping. I'm making my first large test batch of chocolates in 2 weeks and I will keep that in mind.

-Kaydee

To understand tempering chocolate, you need to keep in mind that with the exception of your melting temperature, the cocoa butter is crystalizing ALL the time. At it's ideal working temperature, if you don't agitate it, the chocolate will go solid on you. Also, room temperature plays a big part in the crystalization - especially if you aren't agitating your chocolate properly.

Agitation is THE most important part of working with chocolate. ALL tempering machines will be agitating the chocolate at all times, in order to keep in a working state and prevent it from solidifying. If you are tempering chocolate by hand, you need to be stirring it 100% of the time you are working with it, or you will always get bloom.

One other thing: When you reheat your chocolate on your double boiler (after melting and cooling it) to it's working temperature, remove it from the double boiler approximately 5 degrees LOWER than your target temperature. The reason for this is because your pot will still be hot, and will continue to drag the temperature up (and out of temper) for a few minutes after it is removed from the heat. If you remove it too soon, you can always bring it up a degree or two with a blow dryer on the low setting blown directly on the chocolate while you are stirring it.

Cheers.

Brad.

A melter (such as a Mol d'Art is used for keeping chocolate at working temp. It melts the chocolate at a high temp, then you temper the choc and reduce the temp on the melting tank. When you put the tempered choc back into the unit, it holds it at the correct temp. A melter will simply hold the choc at a given temp, it will not temper the chocolate for you.

A tempering machine will do both - it will melt your chocolate, temper it and then hold it at the working temp.

I am teaching myself to temper chocolate right now and I'm wondering the best way to hold the temperature of the chocolate. I'm using a double boiler and using both milk and dark chocolate. I followed the temperature curve but still got fat bloom. I dipped approximately 25 chocolates and only about 5 of them turned out without the bloom!

When using the double boiler method, should the temperature of the burner be lowered once the chocolate has reached it's melting temperature?

Any tips for keeping chocolate at a working temperature will be greatly appreciated.

I've been looking into getting a tempering machine or the more European style pan melter at some point. Can the melter be used for tempering? How should I decide which one to get (aside from cost, unless one is more economical with the same results)?

Hi, I am a raw foodist from New Zealand living in switzerland and have developed the love of making raw chocolate and I am travelling in ecuador at the moment to escape the swiss winter.

I really want to buy coca [sic: cocoa is probably what was meant] products and apart from ready made chocolate bars I am struggling to find anywhere I can buy the raw product ie. powder, butter, nibs or anything 100%. Does anyone know anywhere in quito [Ecuador]that I could buy wholesale amounts. Or any other place that has good organic cocoa. I have 1 more month here till early may and would really love to find a good supplier who I can ship stuff back to switzerland regularly later down the track as well.

I have one with the enrober. It is a good little machine. Like Kerry says, low tech. It isn't the greatest temper, but for the price, it certainly will get the job done.

They are pretty low tech - don't think you need to worry too much about a lemon. They are made in Quebec so if a thermostat goes you should be able to get replacements easily. I like the idea of the Air vs their water version.

You can add a Perfect enrober to the Air 2 as well when your business grows more (I think I saw one for sale on the classifieds here on CL) .

Hi everyone! Just wanted to ask your professional opinions on a temperer I've found locally. [Edited to add: Locally is Toronto, Ontario, Canada.]

A shop in my area is going out of business and they are selling their temperer. I believe it is an Air 2 made by Perfect inc (just the info the seller has send me, so I haven't had a chance to verify). The seller mentioned he used this unit more for a melter versus a temperer (using compound) The machine appears to be 10 plus years old and does have a wheel attachment. It's a counter unit.
I don't have an immediate need for the machine, but also know they don't come up used too often. He's asking for $1200 for the unit. Which I believe is fair. I'd be interested to hear your opinions and what the downside/ additional cost will be if I get a lemon. He was using the machine up until a few weeks ago.
Thanks

Sometimes the Flat Rate Shipping is great, depending on what you are sending. But if your items are smaller and weigh less than a pound, you may want to look into sending it regular mail because it can by way cheaper! I send my 4 pc truffle boxes out for $2.60 using the post office and my own boxes (cost of box included in that #) Another issue is the weight of the ice packs, they can add a lot of price to the shipping, so sometimes the flat rate boxes are good for that. It just depends on the weight of your boxes and how much you are shipping. You have to figure out the balance. During the holiday season I found that the flat rate priority mail boxes had the same shipping time as regular mail, items were arriving 4 days after the estimated time on the receipt for priority mail. So sometimes looking into getting a fedex acct is just the same or cheaper, and def. more reliable.

Another item - using bubble wrap is great but think about adding some nice touches, i use paper shred in all my boxes and it looks a lot better than bubble wrap and is probably cheaper, they come in 20lb boxes and last for many mailings and are good for other things like gift baskets and other decor accents.

Happy Friday!

Hi Valerie,

Pick out the candy boxes you like and fit your brand, then go to ULine or another shipping supplies store and find sturdy boxes to ship your candy boxes in. This is much cheaper than buying the boxes at your shipping store in your city. Uline has many different dimensions and they hold up in shipping well. Also Daniel is right, make sure to include the candy trays and candy pads in your candy boxes, this helps a great deal in shipping. Candy cups help too!

Hi Valerie,

I would recommend checking out the boxes at Chocolat Chocolat in Quebec. Putting your chocolate bon bons in a candy tray with a candy pad on top of the confections is the safest way for your bon bons to arrive safely. I would just be sure that your bon bons are designed to fit the candy tray. Good luck!

Daniel

Wow! Good luck to you! I look forward to hearing the developments of this project!

I've been toying with the idea of making a small tempering/enrobing machine - I'm thinking that in principle they're not *too* complicated, and at present I'm producing quite small quantities of truffles so a big machine would be overkill (and more than I can afford).

I'm thinking of something along the lines of... taking a small chocolate fountain machine (as it has a pump and heating element), adding thermostatic control to the heating element to allow tempering, then adding some tubing to re-route the chocolate flow to a simple 'waterfall' positioned over a simple conveyer belt (that might take a small dip downwards through a trough to cover the truffle bases)

Now there's plenty of detail to get right there, but I'm just wondering if anyone has tried anything like this before and has any pointers...

Brad:

From personal experience dealing with many, many people in the chocolate world at all levels of experience and understanding from all over the world for more than a decade, I can tell with certainty that it is possible for someone to hold two contradictory opinions in their heads at the same time. Usually it is out of ignorance (often only partial knowledge as we all know a little knowledge is a dangerous thing) and not out of any deliberate attempt to misrepresent.

What I do like about the above reply is that you spent some time to find and present information about HAACP and present it in this discussion.

What I don't like about the above is that you presume malice on the part of the OP. I am a voracious reader and one quote I like is(I am paraphrasing here): "Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by ignorance." I also like this one from Goethe: "...misunderstandings and neglect create more confusion in this world than trickery and malice. At any rate, the last two are certainly much less frequent."

The root of my approach to moderating TheChocolateLife is to assume that people have incomplete knowledge and incomplete understanding. It is rare, I have found for people to deliberately misrepresent themselves here.

That's where I start from. I've been working in chocolate for over a decade and I freely admit that there is stuff I don't know. And there is stuff I will never know. But it's one of the reasons I started TheChocolateLife - so I could learn from thousands of others around the world who love chocolate. I did not create TheChocolateLife as a forum for members to publicly shame and ridicule other members because they did not have perfect knowledge.

There's a line in my book about the most important thing to take to a chocolate tasting - and that's a sense of humor. I go on to say that it's okay to take the chocolate seriously but we should be wary about taking our selves too seriously. Having humility and empathy is important, in my opinion.

And that's the tone I am striving for here, and it has certainly informed my approach to my chocolate career, moving away from calling myself a critic and focusing on mentoring and educating.

I try to lead by example - and sometimes I fail. And the community has lost some very strong, technically, members. And the community is the less for that. However, it's important for me to keep in mind at all times that this is just chocolate.

Brad - You have a lot of useful and valuable information to impart to the community. What you don't recognize (or if you do you simply don't care) is that you undermine yourself and your knowledge when you choose to be confrontational.

All I am asking is that you respect my wishes about how I want members address and speak to other members. I am very clear about that in the member guidelines and in the way I moderate discussions. You can make all the points you make - and people will actually want to listen to you - by being less confrontational.

It's like Gordon Ramsey is your role model here.

TheChocolateLife is not your community. You may feel, as a member, that you are entitled to unbridled expression: That is not the case.If you want a place where you are free to say whatever you want, however you want, then by all means start your own blog or community and open it up forunmoderated(prior to posting) comments from readers/members. It is in this last aspect that I lost any remaining shred of respect for Sam. She makes untrue allegations about me - publicly - but is unwilling to allow any form of feedback or rebuttal.

And at this point, I am closing this discussion for at least 48 hours to let the flames die down.

You dont have a point Brad just a series of condescending, poorly constructed, rude rants. Upon reflection they are more laughable than libellous.

Can I say my (as in bought in burk) cacao powder is light brown? Appears roughly grinded? Tastes fantastic but sometimes a bit bitter? I (John) care about organics, fair trade and the nutritional value of foods. Why can't I say that? Or is it against your overbearing, chocolate fascist rules?

The point that I'm getting at is that as it applies to your original question, who cares if it's "fair trade, organic cold pressed"??? These qualities whether true or not are irrelevant. It's just cocoa powder, yet you seemed to feel it important to qualify it for some reason.

If cocoa powder is "fair trade" does that make the particle size different? Nope.

If the cocoa powder is "organic", does that make the particle size different? Nope.

If it's "cold pressed" (even IF you can prove that claim which I don't believe you can), does that make the particle size different? Nope again.

Particlesize is directly related to the milling of the press cake after the valuable cocoa butter is extracted.

I fully understand the English Language, and fully understand that the adjectives you added to the noun were irrelevant to begin with, and mislead people into believing it is something which it isn't, when what most cocoa powder really is, is a by-product of extracting cocoa butter from beans that nobody wants to make into chocolate.

You can call me names all you want, because that's all you have. You can provide NO valuable or substantiable information which refutes what I claim.

But then again, what do I know, I wasn't on the debate team in school. I was busy being a dumb jock.

Brad

>it's highly doubtful that you even have a clue if it's fair trade or organic!

We have copies of the organic certifications...

>the guy who misleads people

In what way? By saying we buy cold pressed cacao powder from reputable suppliers...

>Either Iceblocks is lying about HACCP,
>OR Iceblocks is lying about his cocoa butter being cold pressed.

Because the suppliers claim its raw, before combining with other pasteurized products, the powder must be pasteurized. That is actually a HACCP critical control step.
We don't use cocao butter. What a burk.

What's highly doubtful is your ability to comprehend English or intellectually understand. What is unquestionable is your condescending rudeness

Now can we get back on topic